Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick Latona
A few weeks ago I started buying .in names as fast as I could. Since then, I've been hearing horror stories about them.
Notable domain attorneys have told me that it is impossible to defend them. I'm told that the .in registry is infamous for making up reasons to give your name to any Indian company that files a complaint.
What are your experiences?
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This is not true in 99% of the cases. if you talk to notable lawyers having deep knowledge in the Indian IT Laws then I am sure they would give you a different picture. It is a sunrise sector and there are not many lawyers in India who know the IT laws as best as they should but there are still a few excellent people out there who can defend your case quite well.
There were a bunch of people who had registered false TM's under various heads to capture these remarkable domains via the reverse hijacking way.
Indian or non Indian company if you can hold your ground you get to keep your name and inspite of all your efforts if you still loose a case with them you can still get a stay order from the high court to prevent the domain being taken away from you till the case is disposed off. Needless to say the domain stays in your account but in a suspended locked mode.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel
Well, they're right. I once owned hotels.in and jobs.in... I've learned my lesson and now stay away from .in.
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I read the cases and alas you were indeed the victim of reverse domain hijacking.
Quote:
Originally Posted by npuva
You all are making me nervous. I have a few WiMax .in names and because WiMax is so much bigger there than in the US perhaps I'll suffer the same fate.
Hotels.in is a terrible name to lose!
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As long as you dont have a too generic name and another company doesnt own a TM in that area you get to keep your domain. Best way to keep a .in name to have some development on it and not park it at all.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick Latona
What was their excuse for takng them?
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There was a cartel working as a group in taking away these names from their genuine owners. the modus operandi was to register multiple false TM's relating to these generic terms and then claim them as their property.
Almost all the TM's were related to the tobacco industry and reading the case of Business.in will give you a clear understanding of what exactly happened. There are multiple sources of information proving the false TM;s and the classic case of reverse domain hijacking.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel
Both domains were challenged under INDRP (.in dispute resolution):
In the case of hotels.in DirectI claimed that I was violating their "hotel" trademark.
They (the parent company of Skenzo) were further arguing that domain parking constitutes bad faith.
jobs.in was awarded to someone who owns several generic (and unused) trademarks for tobacco products (and who is a friend of the arbitrator according to his own web site[1])...
The decisions can be found at http://www.registry.in/policies/disp...ute_decisions/
As one can see there were quite a few other disputes concerning generic domains, each of them obviously resting on bogus arguments.
[1]: http://www.jagdishpurohit.com/credit.htm (Manoj Bhatt was the arbitrator in the jobs.in case who also hosted a personal page on the complainant's web portal indiapress.org that is now offline). |
exactly my point, all these cases revolved around the false TM's under tobacco industry and they were aided directly or indirectly by outsiders in taking away these names.
Directi had also registered these TM's under some pretext and used the same TM to take away them name, claiming it violated their TM and the name was parked even though they own one of the biggest parking companies in the world, amusing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel
Yes, there are court cases pending. What do you mean by "was actually taken by Directi"?
Ever heard of reverse domain hijacking?
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Classic and blatant case of reverse domain hijacking
Quote:
Originally Posted by 888
I remember Daniel losing those names, scandalous on behalf of Directi & their '"buddies". Directi, a registrar and one of the main beneficiaries of the launch- . I don't think they are too much involved in this "hijacking" now they are mainstream and looking to list- potential bad publicity. 
They also "claimed" - "caught" the majority of the premium .co.in that were released at the same time as the .in land rush- not exactly a free and fair distribution as I commented on a few occasions at the time- deaf ears abounded.
Business.in is held by the National Internet Exchange of India. Web.in - Domain On Hold For Compliance.
I have not heard of any recent "hijackings" - could be wrong.  |
Business.in case result is the best answer to the scenario and also proves how false TM's were used to obtain these names.
Off lately the cases have been pertaining to international registered TM's being cyber squatted by some domainers. Nothing as blatant as what happened in the past.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anunt
I am traveling in India right now and i have learned one thing very quickly -- Money Talks!
Lots of corruption going on here in India. You can easily get away with almost anything in india if you have the money. You can pay off the court system, police officers...anybody!
In court cases...what they have a tendency of doing out here is pro-longing the court cases for years and years...the case never gets solved!
Anybody out here can take your dot in domains if they really wanted to...all they have to do is pay off the main person and its done...and if there is a court case...this case will go on forever!
Do a whois check to see who owns all the top best .in domains...less than 5 people own the top best .in domains...i wonder how they got them all!!!
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I think you have a very notion about the entire scenario. If it would have been so easy these so called people would have taken away the cream of all the .in names.
I can give you a detailed list of all the .in and .co.in portfolio holders scattered around the world.
As far as corruption goes I think it happens everywhere in the world, just the degree of severity differs.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick Latona
I talked to a couple of well known domain lawyers today that told me they have never successfully defended a .in case.
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The best person to defend the same would be one of the most notable Supreme court lawyers in India, who is also one of the most learned person in Indian cyber laws.
He is expensive and the name would justify hiring him to defend the case or not. You can call him the John Berryhill of India
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carter
It's scandalous what happened to Daniel...I ask myself why they act like this (I know the obvious value of these 2 domains but it's scandalous too).
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Long term profiteering by way of Reverse Domain Hijacking
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick Latona
I agree that most could lose 10% of their portfolio and still make out in the long-run.
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Trust me, if you develop most of the names using your minisites there is a very small chance that you will loose any of your names.
Quote:
Originally Posted by zapdaddy
I didn't realize it was so easy to lose .in
I'll have to think twice about buying any more.
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Its not that bad anymore.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 888
These disputes were 3/4 years ago?- I have heard of nothing recently unless referring to blatant tm's
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These cases happened in the initial years, not anymore since now is the time to capitalize and profit from them and no one likes to have negative publicity at the wrong time and place.
Quote:
Originally Posted by chandan
hire some local killers cheap and best  |
Does it settle the basic problem
Quote:
Originally Posted by domains
I would like to add that adult domains can also be a risky proposition if you are into .in domains.
In Daniel's case i feel he got cheated by the INDRP either knowingly or unknowingly. It looks to me as a well-planned case of reverse domain hijacking involving influential persons.
Someone or an organization representing .in domain investors should approach the ICANN / WIPO to take action against the INDRP and the .in registry. At least this reverse domain hijacking phenomenon should be stopped in the near future as it will malign the image of the country and its registry which will in turn affect every stakeholder involved in '.in' domain names as a business.
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Adult domains would surely be VERY risky to monetize in the .in and .co.in space as online or offline pornography is illegal in India and you can land behind the bars if you are found to be connected with it in any way.
Things might change in future as liberalization continues but as of now its a big NO NO.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gem
I donot think Jagdish Purohit and Directi have any relation as far as domains hijacking are concern , may be Jagdish will be a regular customer or reseller of Directi ? and Regisrar is concern with the business, he/she donot know how his/her client procure the domains ?
Mitsu charged me USD 200 for TM registration....
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if I am not wrong Mitsu.in is a reseller for Directi
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gem
I donot want to give my identity as my domian case is still pending before higher courts and comments on this forum may harm outcome of my case....?
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Best of luck to you
I made all these observations in my individual capacity since I held a decent portfolio of .in and .co.in names, including the likes of Internet,co,in etc which I subsequently sold off and still do retain a good portfolio.
We can all go on and on but the rules are not going to change and it is in our interest to create a level playing field staying within the rule book.
Its tough but it can be done.