Using ccTLD's for 'Hacked Domain Names'

Billbo · 04-13-2009, 08:38 PM

Do any other members here create 'Hacked Domain Names' (HDN's) using ccTLD's?

I know from other forums that there are a fair few domainers who like HDN's and see them as a marketing asset. Two of the best known examples are of course:

Blo.gs
Del.icio.us

I have JesusChri.st, though my attempts to sell it to an end-user have drawn a blank, but there does seem to be a steady increase in the number of private sales of HDN's occuring. Of course the fact that the 'Big Boys' will not take them seriously and include them in their auctions par se does seem to be putting a damper on their acceptance amoung main stream domainers.

mvl · 04-13-2009, 08:40 PM

I have megabit.ch which is a generic and a hack at the same time.

Rick Latona · 04-13-2009, 11:57 PM

I've never had any luck trying to sell domain hacks.

DotUs · 04-14-2009, 05:05 AM

Never had many myself,

only 1 i'd like is.

ster.us

as in

email me: webm@ster.us nice

Billbo · 04-14-2009, 08:23 AM

I was nieve to think that it would be easy selling JesusChri.st to an end user, I tried contacting televangelists and churches in the States as I percieved them as being the most likely end-users to realise the value of this particular HDN. The problem I have found is that it is impossible to get the information through to those that count in these organisations.

I did develop the domain as a site back in May last year when I put up the NKJV of the Bible on the site and it quickly started to gain in popularity, within a few weeks it was getting more visitors than JesusChrist.com! In fact in the religious genre it was only being beaten for popularity by Bible.com and Bible.org. Then I received a C&D from the attorney for Nelsons publishers who informed me that the NKJV of the Bible is copyrighted by Nelsons, so I had no choice but to close the site down. I eventually redesigned the site using the old 1611 KJV of the Bible, that couldn't be copyrighted because it was so old - WRONG! The KJV is copyrighted to the Crown in perpertuity, so although again it was within just a couple of weeks gaining visitors I again had to take the site down. The fact that an HDN can prove so popular so quickly is testament (no pun intended) that given obvious public recognition of an HDN then it has definate value, the problem is simply that of getting it to the attention of end users.

Some sales of HDN's include:

Li.st ...............$5,000
Christm.as .........$900
Virus.es .........$2,660
Languag.es .....$1,353
Magaz.in ........$4,000 (and yes that is the correct spelling in some european languages)
Foru.ms .........$7,000
Wi.fi ............$37,500

Daniel Dryzek · 04-14-2009, 02:18 PM

I really can't see the future for domain hacks. So in my opinion it is a waste of time and money to invest in them.

DD

mvl · 04-14-2009, 02:26 PM

I don't believe in hacks as an investment. In some cases they might be suitable for development, but you got to have a very strong plan or a lot af luck. A hack like del.icio.us became a succes despite the domainname, not because of the domainname.

Daniel Dryzek · 04-14-2009, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mvl

I don't believe in hacks as an investment. In some cases they might be suitable for development, but you got to have a very strong plan or a lot af luck. A hack like del.icio.us became a succes despite the domainname, not because of the domainname.

I agree and also sites like del.icio.us in the end buy also delicious.com domain name, because people will have problems to remember correctly domain hacks.

DD

Billbo · 04-14-2009, 02:48 PM

What about blo.gs? Or would any old name have got as much prominance?

Any domain needs development to fulfill its potential, that is whether the domain is an HDN or not. In business terms it is the business plan and the development of that plan that counts, you can have a business plan where either you rent a shop on Main Street and pay a fortune every year for the rental or you develop a business plan whereby you save money on rental and spend it identifying your core customer base and interacting with them. If you are a general purpose retailer then the Main Street shop is likely best suited to yout requirements whereas is you are an accountant then you do not need a Main Street site and paying Main Street rents.

Unless developed I do not see many HDN's making the money that the equivalent .com would make, but then again the .com's are already registered and owned whereas the novelty factor and public recognition of a good HDN can easily be used to advantage in marketing terms. I really wish I had managed to get such names as 'Li.st', 'Life.is', 'Foru.ms', to mention but a few, their development potential is huge, really only limited by the owners imagination, understanding of public psychology, and yes I guess cash flow.

Oh and if HDN's don't make money then how could Del.icio.us afford to buy the .com?

Daniel Dryzek · 04-14-2009, 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Billbo

Oh and if HDN's don't make money then how could Del.icio.us afford to buy the .com?

Like mvl wrote:

Quote:

A hack like del.icio.us became a succes despite the domainname, not because of the domainname.

And we hear about successful domain hacks very rare comparing with "normal" domains. That's why I think focusing on domain hacks only takes our time that could be spent on other more profitable names.

DD

Billbo · 04-14-2009, 03:47 PM

Daniel you don't apply your argument to 'blo.gs' though?

Considering the rarity of HDN's compared to all the possible mundane domains that are registered it is not surprising that they are not front page news as much as the run-of-the-mill millions of domain names that are registered.

By the definition an HDN has to be identifiable as a word or phrase, unfortunately the same is not true of the millions of useless domains that are registered each year that are not HDN's. Don't misunderstand me, my first 5 figure sale was College.st, not an HDN, the majority of my portfolio is not HDN's, but I do recognise their value for both marketing and public recognition purposes, and for that last reason alone I generally champion them.

Daniel Dryzek · 04-14-2009, 09:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Billbo

Daniel you don't apply your argument to 'blo.gs' though?

blo.gs is just another example. But I am still skeptical about domain hacks. To be honest - if I had to choose between blo.gs and some "normal" domain name to built website on it - would go for "normal" domain rather than domain hack - blo.gs.

But as I said in previous posts - that's only my feeling about those domains and I do not claim that there aren't people and companies that could be interested in buying such domains. So investing in domain hacks can be profitable too.

DD

Alfredo · 04-15-2009, 01:53 PM

I don't like domain hack. It's difficult to sale.

More domain hacks:
su.bscri.be :: whats new on the web? - View All
Mov.ie™: The Mov.ie Service
Who.is: Whois, Website, Domain Name, and IP Tools - Who.is

Billbo · 04-15-2009, 02:07 PM

I must agree that selling HDN's is harder to general businesses than 'normal' domains, there is a retistance to anything out of the ordinary, however, as a marketing tool they can be extremely effective. Indeed just this morning I have registered one HDN that I am going to use to front a massive project - now just to find a reliable programmer to encode some of the script for me, but that is another story.

Generally speaking the most 'valuable' words/phrases have already been registered in all possible domains and to purchase such domains on the aftermarket can be prohibitively expensive, so going along the HDN route is simply thinking outside the box for a new solution.

One quick last comment here, a bad HDN is just like any other bad domain, pointless.

Billbo · 04-18-2009, 04:26 PM

Just saw wav.es on auction at Sedo, $1,000 opening bid.

Great site name for a social site (wave to friends/wave hello, wave goodbye), a beach holiday site, and of course a surfing site.

jmcc · 04-18-2009, 06:02 PM

One of the reasons that domain hack names don't do well is because of the way that people think and remember. They generally don't think in terms of dots so if you tell someone a domain hack name, they will almost automatically append the local ccTLD extension or .com to the domain. Domain hacks may seem good to a domainer but you've got to keep your users/audience in mind.

Regards...jmcc

Billbo · 04-18-2009, 06:53 PM

JM to some extent I can confirm what you say about HDN's, however, using the short while that JesusChri.st was up for last year as an example the .com visitors increased initially quite drastically, but as people started to realise that the site they wanted was JesusChri.st and not JesusChrist.com the number of visitors visiting JesusChri.st started to overtake the .com! It is simple people bookmarked the site, remembered the site when they found it, and site for site JesusChri.st became far more popular, and that was within a space of a few weeks of launch.

Do not underestimate the public, they remember any untold number of abbreviated names, and this is just another kind of abbreviation.

So as the owner of an HDN site be prepared to initially lose bleed to the .com, but if your site is what people want you will soon outstrip a poorly developed .com, and of course you will have paid a darn site less for the domain!

500ml · 04-19-2009, 01:34 AM

if you are thinking about domain hacks from a marketing angle, i think it might be better to go with a keyword.cctld domain name as that is much easier to remember, it is also wiser from from seo angle, as g00gle will recognize and give you some points for it, and also people who you network with will also recognize its seo value, whereas with pure hack, you get no seo points.

I was on a teleconference call with an affiliate network, because they like to screen their affiliate before accepting them into their program, and they expressed interest in one of my websites built on a cctld, because it was directly relevant to their product, and was actually surprised at their receptiveness to this domain. They didn't seem to care that it's from a different cctld.
This is just my personal opinion

aZooZa · 04-20-2009, 09:27 AM

I think some of them have the potential to work quite well, especially the 'blo.gs' one. I tried this type of thing over a decade ago with rubbish like thefishing.net and thetennis.net -- stupidity will not allow me to let them drop

Daniel Dryzek · 04-20-2009, 09:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aZooZa

I think some of them have the potential to work quite well, especially the 'blo.gs' one. I tried this type of thing over a decade ago with rubbish like thefishing.net and thetennis.net -- stupidity will not allow me to let them drop

Creative ones I have to admit

But only collector's value..

DD

Billbo · 04-20-2009, 10:44 AM

Hi aZooZa, great to see you on here.

I like 'thefishing.net' although of course the golden nugget would have been without the word 'the' in. I think that one in particular could very easily be developed into an extremely popular and well monetized site.

I am working on a site at the moment, and it is the BIG ONE, that uses an HDN but is two keyword pure plus suffix which makes it three keywords! I will develop it as a special kind of Geo site, already have identified over 3,000 towns and cities that will each be monetized by a very under utilised advertising niche. As always it is designing the site and a little bit of programming required that is the pain, but hell what is life without some little problems every now and again!

By the way unit.es is on Sedo auction at 1,000, that can of course be either 'unit (dot) es' or 'unites' as an HDN. Also on Sedo is 'Wav.es', obviously 'waves' as an HDN, current bid is 1,000 Euros.

aZooZa · 04-20-2009, 11:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Billbo

Hi aZooZa, great to see you on here.

I like 'thefishing.net' although of course the golden nugget would have been without the word 'the' in. I think that one in particular could very easily be developed into an extremely popular and well monetized site.

I am working on a site at the moment, and it is the BIG ONE, that uses an HDN but is two keyword pure plus suffix which makes it three keywords! I will develop it as a special kind of Geo site, already have identified over 3,000 towns and cities that will each be monetized by a very under utilised advertising niche. As always it is designing the site and a little bit of programming required that is the pain, but hell what is life without some little problems every now and again!

By the way unit.es is on Sedo auction at 1,000, that can of course be either 'unit (dot) es' or 'unites' as an HDN. Also on Sedo is 'Wav.es', obviously 'waves' as an HDN, current bid is 1,000 Euros.

Yo Bill

Likewise.

I just dropped payfor.my but that was only a defensive registration to cover my payfor.com domain which I'm still trying to thing of something to do with

Maybe escrow or something given that I haven't found a way to try and compete with PayPal without jumping through some very huge regulatory hoops.

aZooZa · 04-20-2009, 11:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mvl

I have megabit.ch which is a generic and a hack at the same time.

Great domain!

Billbo · 04-21-2009, 02:29 PM

Recycle.it is up for sale via auction on Bido.com in a couple of hours time.

Link

This is a great HDN, and for those that have doubts about HDN's it is surely one they would acknowledge has great value. Unfortunately my budget just will not extend at the moment to buy this one.

mvl · 04-21-2009, 02:35 PM

That's a generic. I see why you could call it a hack, but there is a huge difference between a creative combination of a generic and a tld, and a true hack like vegetabl.es or cordonbl.eu.

04-13-2009, 08:38 PM	#1 (permalink)
Billbo Status: Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 35	Using ccTLD's for 'Hacked Domain Names' Do any other members here create 'Hacked Domain Names' (HDN's) using ccTLD's? I know from other forums that there are a fair few domainers who like HDN's and see them as a marketing asset. Two of the best known examples are of course: Blo.gs Del.icio.us I have JesusChri.st, though my attempts to sell it to an end-user have drawn a blank, but there does seem to be a steady increase in the number of private sales of HDN's occuring. Of course the fact that the 'Big Boys' will not take them seriously and include them in their auctions par se does seem to be putting a damper on their acceptance amoung main stream domainers. Last edited by Billbo; 04-13-2009 at 08:47 PM.

04-13-2009, 08:40 PM	#2 (permalink)
mvl Status: Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 66	Re: Using ccTLD's for 'Hacked Domain Names' I have megabit.ch which is a generic and a hack at the same time. __________________ http://sxt.nl

04-13-2009, 11:57 PM	#3 (permalink)
Rick Latona Status: Janitor Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Atlanta Posts: 224	Re: Using ccTLD's for 'Hacked Domain Names' I've never had any luck trying to sell domain hacks. __________________ Rick Latona rick AT ricklatona.com Join the hottest newsletter in domains to find great deals. Borrow money against your names at DigiPawn.com aeiou.com is the only web development company which will add value to your names every time. Ask us why.

04-14-2009, 05:05 AM	#4 (permalink)
DotUs Status: Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 65	Re: Using ccTLD's for 'Hacked Domain Names' Never had many myself, only 1 i'd like is. ster.us as in email me: webm@ster.us nice __________________ NEW.US Simple, Secure, Smart - Coming Soon!

04-14-2009, 08:23 AM	#5 (permalink)
Billbo Status: Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 35	Re: Using ccTLD's for 'Hacked Domain Names' I was nieve to think that it would be easy selling JesusChri.st to an end user, I tried contacting televangelists and churches in the States as I percieved them as being the most likely end-users to realise the value of this particular HDN. The problem I have found is that it is impossible to get the information through to those that count in these organisations. I did develop the domain as a site back in May last year when I put up the NKJV of the Bible on the site and it quickly started to gain in popularity, within a few weeks it was getting more visitors than JesusChrist.com! In fact in the religious genre it was only being beaten for popularity by Bible.com and Bible.org. Then I received a C&D from the attorney for Nelsons publishers who informed me that the NKJV of the Bible is copyrighted by Nelsons, so I had no choice but to close the site down. I eventually redesigned the site using the old 1611 KJV of the Bible, that couldn't be copyrighted because it was so old - WRONG! The KJV is copyrighted to the Crown in perpertuity, so although again it was within just a couple of weeks gaining visitors I again had to take the site down. The fact that an HDN can prove so popular so quickly is testament (no pun intended) that given obvious public recognition of an HDN then it has definate value, the problem is simply that of getting it to the attention of end users. Some sales of HDN's include: Li.st ...............$5,000 Christm.as .........$900 Virus.es .........$2,660 Languag.es .....$1,353 Magaz.in ........$4,000 (and yes that is the correct spelling in some european languages) Foru.ms .........$7,000 Wi.fi ............$37,500 Last edited by Billbo; 04-14-2009 at 02:51 PM.

04-14-2009, 02:18 PM	#6 (permalink)
Daniel Dryzek Status: Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Warsaw, PL Posts: 390	Re: Using ccTLD's for 'Hacked Domain Names' I really can't see the future for domain hacks. So in my opinion it is a waste of time and money to invest in them. DD __________________ MeetDomainers.eu – Truly European Meeting of Domain Investors! Domain Market in Europe / Follow me on Twitter! ddfund.eu - ccTLD domain fund & domain development

04-14-2009, 02:26 PM	#7 (permalink)
mvl Status: Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 66	Re: Using ccTLD's for 'Hacked Domain Names' I don't believe in hacks as an investment. In some cases they might be suitable for development, but you got to have a very strong plan or a lot af luck. A hack like del.icio.us became a succes despite the domainname, not because of the domainname. __________________ http://sxt.nl

04-14-2009, 02:48 PM	#9 (permalink)
Billbo Status: Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 35	Re: Using ccTLD's for 'Hacked Domain Names' What about blo.gs? Or would any old name have got as much prominance? Any domain needs development to fulfill its potential, that is whether the domain is an HDN or not. In business terms it is the business plan and the development of that plan that counts, you can have a business plan where either you rent a shop on Main Street and pay a fortune every year for the rental or you develop a business plan whereby you save money on rental and spend it identifying your core customer base and interacting with them. If you are a general purpose retailer then the Main Street shop is likely best suited to yout requirements whereas is you are an accountant then you do not need a Main Street site and paying Main Street rents. Unless developed I do not see many HDN's making the money that the equivalent .com would make, but then again the .com's are already registered and owned whereas the novelty factor and public recognition of a good HDN can easily be used to advantage in marketing terms. I really wish I had managed to get such names as 'Li.st', 'Life.is', 'Foru.ms', to mention but a few, their development potential is huge, really only limited by the owners imagination, understanding of public psychology, and yes I guess cash flow. Oh and if HDN's don't make money then how could Del.icio.us afford to buy the .com? Last edited by Billbo; 04-14-2009 at 02:51 PM.

04-14-2009, 03:47 PM	#11 (permalink)
Billbo Status: Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 35	Re: Using ccTLD's for 'Hacked Domain Names' Daniel you don't apply your argument to 'blo.gs' though? Considering the rarity of HDN's compared to all the possible mundane domains that are registered it is not surprising that they are not front page news as much as the run-of-the-mill millions of domain names that are registered. By the definition an HDN has to be identifiable as a word or phrase, unfortunately the same is not true of the millions of useless domains that are registered each year that are not HDN's. Don't misunderstand me, my first 5 figure sale was College.st, not an HDN, the majority of my portfolio is not HDN's, but I do recognise their value for both marketing and public recognition purposes, and for that last reason alone I generally champion them.

04-15-2009, 01:53 PM	#13 (permalink)
Alfredo Status: Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Spain Posts: 593	Re: Using ccTLD's for 'Hacked Domain Names' I don't like domain hack. It's difficult to sale. More domain hacks: su.bscri.be :: whats new on the web? - View All Mov.ie™: The Mov.ie Service Who.is: Whois, Website, Domain Name, and IP Tools - Who.is

04-15-2009, 02:07 PM	#14 (permalink)
Billbo Status: Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 35	Re: Using ccTLD's for 'Hacked Domain Names' I must agree that selling HDN's is harder to general businesses than 'normal' domains, there is a retistance to anything out of the ordinary, however, as a marketing tool they can be extremely effective. Indeed just this morning I have registered one HDN that I am going to use to front a massive project - now just to find a reliable programmer to encode some of the script for me, but that is another story. Generally speaking the most 'valuable' words/phrases have already been registered in all possible domains and to purchase such domains on the aftermarket can be prohibitively expensive, so going along the HDN route is simply thinking outside the box for a new solution. One quick last comment here, a bad HDN is just like any other bad domain, pointless.

04-18-2009, 04:26 PM	#15 (permalink)
Billbo Status: Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 35	Re: Using ccTLD's for 'Hacked Domain Names' Just saw wav.es on auction at Sedo, $1,000 opening bid. Great site name for a social site (wave to friends/wave hello, wave goodbye), a beach holiday site, and of course a surfing site.

04-18-2009, 06:02 PM	#16 (permalink)
jmcc Status: Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Ireland Posts: 40	Re: Using ccTLD's for 'Hacked Domain Names' One of the reasons that domain hack names don't do well is because of the way that people think and remember. They generally don't think in terms of dots so if you tell someone a domain hack name, they will almost automatically append the local ccTLD extension or .com to the domain. Domain hacks may seem good to a domainer but you've got to keep your users/audience in mind. Regards...jmcc __________________ http://www.hosterstats.com gTLD and ccTLD Domain Registration Stats and Historical DNS Database.

04-18-2009, 06:53 PM	#17 (permalink)
Billbo Status: Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 35	Re: Using ccTLD's for 'Hacked Domain Names' JM to some extent I can confirm what you say about HDN's, however, using the short while that JesusChri.st was up for last year as an example the .com visitors increased initially quite drastically, but as people started to realise that the site they wanted was JesusChri.st and not JesusChrist.com the number of visitors visiting JesusChri.st started to overtake the .com! It is simple people bookmarked the site, remembered the site when they found it, and site for site JesusChri.st became far more popular, and that was within a space of a few weeks of launch. Do not underestimate the public, they remember any untold number of abbreviated names, and this is just another kind of abbreviation. So as the owner of an HDN site be prepared to initially lose bleed to the .com, but if your site is what people want you will soon outstrip a poorly developed .com, and of course you will have paid a darn site less for the domain!

04-19-2009, 01:34 AM	#18 (permalink)
500ml Status: Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 7	Re: Using ccTLD's for 'Hacked Domain Names' if you are thinking about domain hacks from a marketing angle, i think it might be better to go with a keyword.cctld domain name as that is much easier to remember, it is also wiser from from seo angle, as g00gle will recognize and give you some points for it, and also people who you network with will also recognize its seo value, whereas with pure hack, you get no seo points. I was on a teleconference call with an affiliate network, because they like to screen their affiliate before accepting them into their program, and they expressed interest in one of my websites built on a cctld, because it was directly relevant to their product, and was actually surprised at their receptiveness to this domain. They didn't seem to care that it's from a different cctld. This is just my personal opinion

04-20-2009, 09:27 AM	#19 (permalink)
aZooZa Status: Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 10	Re: Using ccTLD's for 'Hacked Domain Names' I think some of them have the potential to work quite well, especially the 'blo.gs' one. I tried this type of thing over a decade ago with rubbish like thefishing.net and thetennis.net -- stupidity will not allow me to let them drop __________________ UK Drop Lists, Public and Hosted Dropcatching Services

04-20-2009, 10:44 AM	#21 (permalink)
Billbo Status: Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 35	Re: Using ccTLD's for 'Hacked Domain Names' Hi aZooZa, great to see you on here. I like 'thefishing.net' although of course the golden nugget would have been without the word 'the' in. I think that one in particular could very easily be developed into an extremely popular and well monetized site. I am working on a site at the moment, and it is the BIG ONE, that uses an HDN but is two keyword pure plus suffix which makes it three keywords! I will develop it as a special kind of Geo site, already have identified over 3,000 towns and cities that will each be monetized by a very under utilised advertising niche. As always it is designing the site and a little bit of programming required that is the pain, but hell what is life without some little problems every now and again! By the way unit.es is on Sedo auction at 1,000, that can of course be either 'unit (dot) es' or 'unites' as an HDN. Also on Sedo is 'Wav.es', obviously 'waves' as an HDN, current bid is 1,000 Euros.

04-21-2009, 02:29 PM	#24 (permalink)
Billbo Status: Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 35	Re: Using ccTLD's for 'Hacked Domain Names' Recycle.it is up for sale via auction on Bido.com in a couple of hours time. Link This is a great HDN, and for those that have doubts about HDN's it is surely one they would acknowledge has great value. Unfortunately my budget just will not extend at the moment to buy this one. Last edited by Billbo; 04-21-2009 at 02:32 PM.

04-21-2009, 02:35 PM	#25 (permalink)
mvl Status: Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 66	Re: Using ccTLD's for 'Hacked Domain Names' That's a generic. I see why you could call it a hack, but there is a huge difference between a creative combination of a generic and a tld, and a true hack like vegetabl.es or cordonbl.eu. __________________ http://sxt.nl

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